The Majalla - Why has the dispute between Sunnis and Shiites intensified recently?
- The origins of the differences between Sunnis and Shiites are not religious, but political. It is a dispute over secondary issues, not basic ones. I think that anyone who believes that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is his Messenger is definitely a Muslim. Therefore, we have been supporting, for a long time, through Al-Azhar, many calls for the reconciliation of Islamic schools of thought. Muslims should work on becoming united, and protecting themselves from denominational sectarian fragmentation. There are no Shiites and no Sunnah. We are all Muslims. Regretfully; the passions and prejudices that some resort to, are the reason behind the fragmentation of the Islamic nation.
The Majalla - What has Al-Azhar done for the unity of the Islamic world, which the Grand Imam dearly believes in?
Al-Azhar is the biggest Sunni reference in the Sunni and Shiite worlds. A fact admitted by the Shiite scholars themselves. Its efforts in this matter are obvious. Shiite scholars always visit us in Al-Azhar asking for our cooperation. They have called for Al-Azhar to establish some of its learning institutes in their countries. The Mufti of the Shiites in Lebanon has asked me during his visit to Al-Azhar to allow Shiite students from Lebanon to study at Al-Azhar. He also demanded Iran to establish a branch of Al-Azhar University on its territory.
The Majalla - Did you welcome such calls and wishes?
I said to them, you are welcome to do so, on the condition that Al-Azhar's curricula are preserved, especially those related to Islamic Shariah. Changes can not be made to them, nor can any thing be omitted from them. Further, teaching in theses institutes must be done by professors from Al-Azhar. All of the Sunni and Shiite doctrines will be taught in these institutions, such as the Twelver and Ibadi Shiite doctrines, and on top of which are the four main Sunni doctrines of Abu Hanifa, Malik, Ibn Hanbal, and Shafi'i. This is our condition for allowing Al-Azhar learning institutions to be established anywhere in the world. There must be no interference or influence by any particular entity or political current. The mission of Al-Azhar is to spread the reasonableness and moderation of Islam. It is not concerned with serving political purposes and objectives, as some other states do. Therefore, we would not allow the noble name of Al-Azhar to be manipulated by militants or extremists.
The Majalla – Some people have warned against the Shiite tide, especially in Egypt and Syria, such as Dr. Yusuf al-Qaradawi. What do you think of this?
Dr. Qaradawi has the right to express his point of view, but I disagree with him completely, as there is no such thing as a Shiite tide in Egypt. Egypt is a Sunni state, and Al-Azhar will not allow for the deployment of Shiism in the country. But it is possible to say that it is the nature of the Egyptians to hold a certain tendency towards Ahl al-Bayt (The family of Muhammad, the prophet of Islam). I want to remind Dr. Qaradawi that the Shiite Fatimids ruled Egypt for about 230 years, and when Saladin forced them to leave the country, there was not one Shiite left in Egypt. But what is really happening is that the Iranian government is using the Shiite doctrine to serve its own political agenda. It aims to penetrate some Arab societies which have significant political weight and influence, particularly Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Syria. Recently, it managed to penetrate Yemen. Iran is manipulating the Shiite doctrine and using it against the communities of these countries. But such attempts are certainly destined to fail, because these communities enjoy a certain immunity and are not easily tricked or bought. I repeat: any talk about a Shiite tide or a Shiite presence in Egypt is totally untrue. But if anybody wishes to become a Shiite, he must not try to spread such a call among a community of Sunnis. He must refrain from causing sedition or implementing malicious schemes.
The Majalla – Why escalate the conflict between Sunnis and Shiites?
I say that anyone who tries to escalate the conflict between Sunnis and Shiites is trying to achieve political goals and to ignore the major issues at stake. Shiite scholars must stop insulting the Sahaba (companions of the prophet Muḥammad), and Aisha (wife of the Prophet Muḥammad). The other irregularities and wrong beliefs found in Shiite books and heritage must be completely removed.
The Majalla - How do you see the position of Hassan Nasrallah, the leader of Hezbollah?
Nasrallah's position towards Egypt is deeply offensive and destructive. They are a call for sedition. He and his likes must refrain from making such a loud noise and giving such rhetoric speeches. It would be better for him to try and solve his own problems instead. Egypt was a great country and will always remain so. It does not pay attention to such small and trivial matters, as President Hosni Mubarak likes to stress. The problem is that such people want to have a role at the expense of countries that have big weights in political history such as Egypt and Saudi Arabia. But they do not know that this is impossible. Deeds rater than loud noise is what makes one have a role in life.
The Majalla - Last year, you rejected an invitation to visit Iran, for what reasons did you do so?
Right, I received an invitation from Iranian officials to attend a conference held to honor one of the scholars there. They asked me to give a speech about the importance of establishing a dialogue between different doctrinal approaches. Given the political conditions, and the problematic relationship that has arisen after the arrest of a terrorist cell in Egypt belonging to the Shiite militia Hezbollah, I strongly rejected the invitation. You know, not every invitation should be accepted. I remember that four years ago I was invited to visit Iran to attend a ceremony held to honor the late Al-Azhar Sheikh Mahmoud Shaltout there. I did not accept the invitation but I sent 10 scholars from Al Azhar Islamic Research Academy members to participate in the ceremony with their researches about Sheikh Shaltout.
The Majalla - Are the books that promote the Shiite ideology carefully examined?
Research and Authorship Committee of the Islamic Research Academy examines any books they receive from any part of the world. Within the framework of cultural exchange between Egypt and Iran, the Iranian books on Fiqh, Education and rapprochement between different ideologies are examined. In this way, we ensure that these books are carefully examined, not because they are Shiite, in fact we do this with all other books in order to ensure they respect the constants of religion.
The Majalla - When will Sheikh Al-Azhar go to Iran?
This depends on the extent to which Iran is willing to stop their aggressive political plans, show their respect and reverence for symbols of Egypt and the Sunni world. I can not accept making a visit to Iran under any circumstances while there is still a street in Tehran carrying the name and picture of the murderer who killed the martyr president Anwar Sadat. Why did Iran make the film, "Execution of the Pharaoh"? Although the Iranian Embassy in Egypt apologized to the Egyptians and Al-Azhar, and the Iranian government absolved themselves of blame for this work, this is not enough. In order for Iran to show its good intentions, further evidence and respect for Egypt with all its symbols should be provided. We will not accept any prejudice against us.
The Majalla - You mean there isn't any kind of rapprochement between different doctrinal approaches?
Since 1946, the Society of Rapprochement between different doctrines aimed to build bridges of understanding between the Sunni and the Shiite. It was established by Sheikh Shaltout and Sheikh Al-Qomi. This committee is still running, but I don't have any idea about the dates of their meetings., I was asked by the Iranian delegation at a UN conference of interfaith dialogue to make rapprochement with them, but we, in our turn, asked them to tell the Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad that we will not seek any kind of rapprochement with Tehran before they make their apologies to Egypt and the family of Late President Sadat. They should first withdraw their defamations and misrepresentations of national symbols of Egypt.
The Majalla - What do you think of the current situation in Iraq, specifically between Sunnis and Shiites?
The issue of Iraqis' fighting and killing themselves is not Islamic at all. Their fighting against each other is a dark dissention. They should realize that the difference in doctrine can never be an excuse for killing our brethrens in religion.
The Majalla - In your opinion, who stands behind this dissention?
I think that suspect regional and global regimes trying to drive a wedge between the Iraqis stand behind the civil war going on in this country.
The Majalla - I think you made a proposal to face this crisis before, am I right?
Yes, I called on Iraqi brethrens for holding a truce, even for one month to reconsider the size of losses and destruction caused to their country as a consequence of killing and fighting each other.
My advice to Iraqis whether they are Kurds, Sunni or Shia is to promote a dialogue between themselves in order to be able to stand up to their enemy. The best way out of the Iraqi crisis is the unity of its people. They should unite their word and efforts without discriminating between the Sunni and the Shiite. In this way, they will put an end to the invasion and not a single soldier will then be seen on Iraq's land.
Interview conducted by Ahmed Ayoub
